Wilson, Douglas L., ed.; Davis, Rodney O., ed.; Carman, Caleb. 'Caleb Carman (William H. Herndon Interview)' in 'Herndon's Informants: Letters, Interviews, and Statements About Abraham Lincoln' . Urbana: University of Illinois Press, 1998. [format: book], [genre: interview]. Permission: University of Illinois Press
Persistent link to this document: http://lincoln.lib.niu.edu/file.php?file=herndon373.html

the woods — cut down 2 hickory sapplings — peeled off the Course outer bark — peeled off the clean tender inner bark and with it bottomed my chairs. Abe ceased boarding with me in 1836 & 7. Abe was very good Kind & courteous to children & women — was sometimes sociable with men — Seen him Survey many times — he often to my own Knowledge attended law cases before Justices of the Peace in & near Salem from 1834 to 1837 — He loved Burns' poetry — Shakespear — and some few other books — read the News papers of the day — the Sangamon Journal & Mo Republican & Louisville Journal: He was always quoting Poetry — singing songs — "Old Suekey blue Skin" ^[1] — Quote Speeches — orations — Make good Speeches to — wrote deeds — contracts — agreements &c for the neighbors & Charged them nothing — He was a good reader rather than a "much reader" as the Indian would Say: what he read he read thoroughly & well & never forgot it. He frequently visited from 1833 — to 1837. young ladies — he Courted Miss Rutledge: she moved down the river a few miles before I got to Salem. He went to see & Courted Miss Owens about 1835 — or — 1836 She was frequently at my house & Abe would gallant her down to Abels ^[2] about 2 M down the River. It is said that she came all the way from Ky to get Lincoln. This I Know nothing about — but doubt. Miss Owen was a handsome woman — a fine looking woman — was Sharp — Shrewd and intellectual I assure you Miss Rutledge was a pretty woman — good natured — kind — wasn't as smart as Miss Owens by a heap. Mentor Graham — and the Greens helped Abe in Grammar — Graham aided him exclusing in Surveying — . I don't remember any jokes about Abe — I Know he sat up late at night and studied hard — rose tolerably Early. Abe ate mechanically — very moderately — didn't seem to Care much what was Set before him — So it was clean. I Knew John A. Kelso: he was a School Master: well educated — loved Shakespear and fishing above all other thing. Abe loved Shakespear but not fishing — still Kelso would draw Abe: they used to sit on the bank of the river and quote Shakespear — criticise one an other. Kelso lives now as I understand in Mo. Kelso, if at himself is a good Shakesperian Schollar for a western man. — think he was a Kentuckian — I say to you that from 1832. or 3 to 1838 — that Lincoln studied law — Studied, Surveying and general politics — was member of the legislature 3 times from New Salem — probably twice and part of an other term. I think Abels frame house was built down under the hill — and not on the top of it: it was a log house on the hill that Lincoln used to see Miss Owens in according to my recollection — Lincoln was Sometimes Sad — was deeply reflective — Sometimes it seemed to me a mix'd State of abstraction & Sadness. His clothing in the winter was Jeans & linnen generally in the Summer. Lincoln never hunted much: he was no hunter — loved sports — threw malls — large pieces of iron — jump — pitch quoits — dollars — never gambled — probably attended horse races — I never saw him at one — played old sledge for fun, and drank his dram occasionally when he wanted it. His friends forced

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